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  #51  
Old 01/09/2008, 03:47 PM
NanoReefWanabe NanoReefWanabe is offline
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if your not inclined to install a cafco overflow...then you could also try using a 1" or PVC piep with a single 1/4" slot cut in it the length of the pipe, save an inch or two in either end....put a cap on one end and attach your 45* and elbow to the other...rotate the slot to be parallel with the surface of the water...

this will work great for surface skimming...

as for your pump issues...i assume your using a submersible pump and in that case i would go with a Mag5 or even a Mag3...also assuming your pumping from a sump in the stand...and not remote location..(ie basement) after head loss the mag five should put you around 300gph to your tank...the Mag3 should leave you around 175ish gph...the mag3 is the better choice in my ind given the size of your bulkhead...

also a side note.

covering the vent hole on your durso will create a full siphon, as soon as the water level in the tank is above the top of the bulkhead...(provided water has started to drain by then) either way once the water is above the BH you will get a full siphon...uncovering the vent hole will allow the drain to revert to semi siphon/ possibly gravity drain...in either case if nothing is done to control the flow of the pump to the tank it will overflow eventually...guaranteed...so covering the vent to achieve desired water level is not a safe practice...

someone mentioned earlier that size of vent hole will not effect the tank level...well you are very wrong...in this particular setup with no overflow box...vent hole will directly effect the water level in the tank...as it will prevent the pipe from siphoning if it is too bing...if thepipe cant establish a semi siphon or a full siphon then the level of the water will be very high if not overflowing given the flow from the pump and the size of the BH...if there where an overflow box then the vent hole would effect the water level in the overflow box...and not the tank unless it was so high above the overflow that it was then effecting the height of the tank aswell..

as Bean mentioned two holes are better then one aswell...

or you could do it the way mine is done and be done with the noise and any flood problems...how is that? i have a 1.5" bulkhead...flex pipe to the sump, down turned elbow on the tank side with a 1/8" hole in the top of it...right above the water level...and only 200GPH from my return...the fish pooping make more noise then my drain..
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  #52  
Old 01/09/2008, 04:10 PM
BeanAnimal BeanAnimal is offline
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Which brings up another point...

Add a John Guest valve to yoru standpipes air intake. This allows adjustment. Attach an airline to the valve and curl it over and clamp it to the rim of the tank so that it is just above the desired maximum water level. If the water rises past that, it will block the airline and create a full siphon. This acts as a small failsafe in case somethin gets slightly out of whack.
  #53  
Old 01/09/2008, 04:15 PM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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I am guessing you would put the airline tubing in the water??
  #54  
Old 01/10/2008, 12:23 AM
Icefire Icefire is offline
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Bean that still of overflow work well but you need to put a single slice at the top, not hole.

Once I setup the 110, that will be my overflow, very discret.
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  #55  
Old 01/10/2008, 12:46 AM
BeanAnimal BeanAnimal is offline
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Icefire... I am not sure what you mean.

Hyrum... no

The air hole in the top of the standpipe allows air to be drawn in with the water. This prevents the standpipe from starting a full siphon and sucking the overflow box dry (think of a toilet flushing).

The size of the hole determines the amount of air that gets mixed with the water. Or in other words how much of a siphon is allowed to form. However, there is a problem. At some point the system will be balanced. The water level in the overflow box will be stable. However, a change in barometric pressure, a snail, a slime coat in the pipes, or any number of other things can cause the system to get slightly out of balance.

Because you do not have a secondary (emergency) overflow, an imbalance could cause the tank to overflow!

So what can you do to get a bit more safety? Attach an airline to the air intake hole on the durso. Position this line just above the maximum safe operating level in the overflow box (or tank rim). Under normal operating conditions the airline will not be submerged and can suck in air.

In the event that the water level rises too high, the open end of the airline will become submerged. This will block the air intake into the standpipe and cause it to create a full siphon. The standpipe will flow more when it is acting as a siphon. You will come home to hear the overflow box flushing and gurgling periodically like a toilet. That is if the standpipe has not been impeded by a snail or other restriction too big to allow the full flow of the return pump to pass, even under a full siphon.
  #56  
Old 01/10/2008, 01:52 AM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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ok but do i really need to be worried about a clog or my drain slowing down with the setup that I have? all the small holes drilled in the pipe will prevent anything big enough from getting to the bulkhead and clogging it AND since there are so many holes if one does get clogged it wont (shouldnt) slow the flow down at all.

Now I am new and appreciate the suggestions and comments and I may incorporate some of these ideas to my setup. I do welcome suggestions and thank you for them, I just like to understand things.....
  #57  
Old 01/10/2008, 10:46 AM
BeanAnimal BeanAnimal is offline
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I am not quite sure how to respond. Please take the comments in stride (you appear to want to learn).

1) Your current setup is terrible. It DOES NOT allow for ANY surface skimming. It looks cool, but does not provide a suitable overflow for an aquarium.

2) Even IF the water level was PERFECT (running at eactly the midpoint of MOST of the holes)... the surface skimming would still not be adequite.

3) The water level in your tank indicates that the overflow is nearly maxed out. Small changes in water or barometric pressure, or a gradual buildup of a slime coat can drastically change the operating parameters of the system.

4) You have complained about noise. The way your system is setup WILL be noisy. Your system relys on a partial siphon to keep up with the return pump . Using a "durso" or "stockman" type of setup will reduce the noise, but also reduce the capacity of the overflow by preventing the siphon.

Here is the bottom line.

1) Reduce the size of (or throttle) the return pump and also add a noise reducing standpipe. Live with the fact that you have no surface skimming (not a good idea).

-or-

2) rethink the whole project.
  #58  
Old 01/10/2008, 11:24 AM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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Haha I do want to learn! The noise is no longer a problem....

I looked at the caflow (spelling?) did not like, I mean its probably no worse looking than what I have now haha..

If I change anything I would like to put an overflow in the corner, one that goes all the way to the bottom of the tank. with that said, is that a good idea? what size? tell me what I would need to know please. I am all about DIY!
  #59  
Old 01/10/2008, 03:40 PM
kgross kgross is offline
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I for one would suggest the Calfo style rather than a corner overflow. You can build the calfo small 3x3 or even 2x3 so it does not take up much tank space. Plus you get much better surface skimming.

Kim
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  #60  
Old 01/10/2008, 05:12 PM
BeanAnimal BeanAnimal is offline
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hyrum...

The noise is no longer a problem because the overflow is fully submerged and NOT surface skimming.

The corner overflow will be limited in the amount of surface skimming it will provide. Extending it to the bottom of the tank will only create a detritus trap (a place for stuff to settle and rot.

We are trying to tell you what you need to know... you just don't appear to like what you are hearing!
  #61  
Old 01/10/2008, 05:23 PM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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Sorry to come off that way, I just like to question so I can fully understand it....

I really do appreciate your help, all of you.

beananimal, how big of a calfo would you install?
  #62  
Old 01/10/2008, 09:41 PM
NanoReefWanabe NanoReefWanabe is offline
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i would install it the length of the tank...as that is how they are designed to be done...

i did a simple quick 5 min paint job to illustrate how i would do it..

slightly modified design...which will completely eliminate the look and intrusivness of an internal overflow...the 45* glass baffle will almost dissapear in the tank as the water refracts the light...

use black glass...if the back of your tank is painted black...if it is blue leave the baffle natural glass colour.

you will have to modify the "T", and the Elbow...also i have included the airline as Bean mentioned...where in the case of a slight obstruction causing the water level to rise, a full siphon will be created once the air line is blocked by the higher water..and as mentioned it will continuously flush and what not as the siphon is broken and created...by rising and lowering water level inside the overflow box...also if you use a Street El' you would be able to cut it off so it is almost flat against the back glass of the tank once installed..i use a slip fitting with a couple wraps of teflon...although i dont think the in tank fitting has to be water tight..

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Last edited by NanoReefWanabe; 01/10/2008 at 09:49 PM.
  #63  
Old 01/10/2008, 10:47 PM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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very interesting! I kinda like that better than the square one. Black glass, is it easy to come by? Wait why do I ask that! I know right where to get it!
  #64  
Old 01/10/2008, 10:49 PM
asm481 asm481 is offline
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Excellent drawing nano... Done with a 1 inch bulkhead would be good for up to 600 gph.
  #65  
Old 01/10/2008, 11:12 PM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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question...How low should the glass be from the rim of the tank?
  #66  
Old 01/10/2008, 11:34 PM
Icefire Icefire is offline
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Bean, if you use a 1.5" PVC tube and slice it 1/4" wide, you can use it to surface skim and it take minimal place in the take.

You can also adjust the water level by rotating the tube
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  #67  
Old 01/10/2008, 11:34 PM
GuySmilie GuySmilie is offline
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At what level do you like to keep the water at in this tank?
Whatever that height is, subtract !/4" to determine how low the glass should be from the rim. The quarter inch is to compensate for the sheeting effect (or flow) over the edge of the glass.
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  #68  
Old 01/11/2008, 12:00 AM
hyrumbradshaw hyrumbradshaw is offline
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perfect guy smile thats what I was wondering 1/4 in below what level i want...
  #69  
Old 01/11/2008, 08:20 AM
NanoReefWanabe NanoReefWanabe is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Icefire
Bean, if you use a 1.5" PVC tube and slice it 1/4" wide, you can use it to surface skim and it take minimal place in the take.

You can also adjust the water level by rotating the tube
this is what i was talking about in the first post of this page...but again, you have to make sure the groove is long enough and wide enough to fully compensate for the cross-sectional area of the bulkhead....

only problem is with too much flow this setup wont work either and he will be in the same boat he is in already...water above the pipe=no surface skimming...
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  #70  
Old 01/11/2008, 09:13 AM
BeanAnimal BeanAnimal is offline
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I place the top edge of overflow even with the lower edge of the trim. That way the tank water level is never lower than the trim.
 

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