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  #1  
Old 12/29/2007, 05:43 PM
dasstheboss dasstheboss is offline
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So you say tap water is no good? Hmm..

Well, i didnt want to post this in the Beginners' Forum because I didn't want to set a bad example for the new reefers out there..

I have had my system running for about 4 months now.. more than that actually and have been successful using PURE TAP WATER.. no chemicals added to it.. no supplements either. I have not done a water change ever since it has been set-up and so there are no heavy metal reactors in the water.. still my tank looks pristine and my LPS and even SPS are thriving. Here is an FTS to prove it:

Pics to hopefully prove my tank's success:












This tank has not had nay algae outbreaks in its life and i only got the usual diatom bloom which went away quickly (2 weeks) to keep phosphates down i use phos-ban once a week.. i have a penguin filter which has it in a media bag and i turn it on once a week since the media must run dry.
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  #2  
Old 12/29/2007, 07:56 PM
poo-tang poo-tang is offline
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have you ever tested your tap water, i have heard people report having a tds of like 20ppm before on tap water, which is awesome. If i had something like that i'd use it too.
also if you aren't supplementing with calcium and a carbonate i doubt you will see much if any growth out of the sps, but i think they will still survive for a while.
  #3  
Old 12/29/2007, 08:41 PM
greenbean36191 greenbean36191 is offline
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Yep, some people have excellent tap water and can actually get away with using it. It's certainly not something I would try without testing my water first though. Also at 4 months, IME it's too early to be claiming success. When I first started out I didn't know any better and I used tap water. Everything was fine for the first 8 months or so when small patches of cyano started showing up. It got progressively worse until I finally just broke down and started over with RO after about a year and a half.
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  #4  
Old 12/29/2007, 08:43 PM
TulsaReefer TulsaReefer is offline
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Your tank looks very nice. It's possible you may be one of the few that has good tap water. Would be interesting to see a test of your water to see what it comes out like. I know that if I did the same where I live, I wouldn't be happy with the results.

And as for declaring success after 4 months, you might want to wait a little longer and then post again with how things are in a bit longer time period. It would be interesting to see how things go over a longer period of time. It's hard to really count 4 months as success, as this is much shorter than the natural lifespan of these creatures. When you hit a few years, or better yet a decade or more, then you can really begin to discuss how things are going. I only wish I had such great tap water myself, though the cost of an RO/DI over the nearly 15 years I've had it hasn't been much, and I've found that the RO/DI water also makes great coffee (no scale build up in the coffee pot).
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  #5  
Old 12/29/2007, 10:51 PM
Justinandkrista Justinandkrista is offline
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Looks like everything is A-ok. My buddy uses tap water on his tanks i think and they do just fine. He says he rarly does water changes either. its also a 125 gallon sysetem so its more balanced. What are the specs on that tank? I think if it works do it, but also beter safe than sorry. If your just using tap water it wouldnt hurt to suplement some stress zyme and stress coat.
  #6  
Old 12/29/2007, 11:31 PM
dasstheboss dasstheboss is offline
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this is a 54 Corner tank with BakPak Skimmer w/o biomedia.. fuge with rubble and chaeto.. there is no light in the fuge but the chaeto has still been growing from my room lighting.. maybe its the nutrients in the water that has been keeping it alive.
It is lighted by a Odyssea 250W Halide w/ PCs and LEDs.. running it stock and seems ot do well. Flow is only a SEIO 820.. sometimes i turn on the Tunze 620 for some surge effect cus it really stirrs stuff up due to my mod.
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  #7  
Old 12/30/2007, 12:21 AM
aurora aurora is offline
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Your picture show a decent softies tank with low bioload. Your corals are all fairly high nutrient corals and appear happy in your tank. You've seem to have reach a good balance in nutrient import and export. I think there a lot of good stuff in tap water that may be beneficial to certain corals as long as you are aware that you are runninga high nutrient system and stay within that limit. However, beware of putting anything with lower nutrient requirements like SPS (except some montipora species) in the tank. BTW...is that a bleached open brain or gonipora in the foreground? Also, your few sps seem to be just hanging on or browned out as they typically will do in high nutrient setting. The problem with most of us is we want a tank stocked with corals and fish. That's where tap water become a problem because it adds more nutrient to the system than we can export. As long as you keep yourself under control and withing your limitation, I think you'll be fine. However, like most of us, the minute that you think you are "successful", a trip to the LFS returns with a few more fish and those bright/beautiful/must have/low nutrient corals...then our trouble starts...LOL.

Last edited by aurora; 12/30/2007 at 12:26 AM.
  #8  
Old 12/30/2007, 12:21 AM
GoingPostal GoingPostal is offline
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Here's another tap water tank for you.






This one's going on three years though, I have two other nanos but no new pics, these are kinda outdated too. I do weekly water changes though.
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  #9  
Old 12/30/2007, 01:18 AM
demonsp demonsp is offline
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LOL. I love a good debate. You say its only 4mths old with all that stock and tap water source. Not sure what you use for flow but i would bet its not enough. I will leave some links that im sure you wont read but i would save them. Also whene you crash or come very close pls come back and post those pics.

Very very few tap water sources are sutiable for SW. And the ill affects take months or yrs to show. And then you wont even think its the source by then and by then curing will be much harder. Hate to see all that coral go south.
You have a hard head and have no right thinking a 4 month tank is a reason for your assumtion. If you dont rethink your reasons for what you do then just keep this thread in mind and be ready for many , I told you so's,. Anyway for waht its worth.


http://www.wetwebmedia.com/water4maruse.htm

http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/sta...opmistakes.htm
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  #10  
Old 12/30/2007, 01:25 AM
demonsp demonsp is offline
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Sorry but this is not a 3 yr old tank pic. I would like to see an updated pic to backup your answer.LOL shows 3 yr old pic and claims ti the basis for his response. Try again.
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  #11  
Old 12/30/2007, 11:50 AM
GoingPostal GoingPostal is offline
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I'm not even sure what you're trying to say with that last response but I assure you it's a three year old tank. I can get you plenty of older pics and a newer one tonight, the only difference now is I've reaquascaped, which happens quite often in my tank, not enough room for all the crap in there. The two first pics are what it looks like now, the last full tank shot is from two months ago. Now the filters off the right side and replaced with a koralia #2. Here's a way old shot from a year and a half ago under pcs before I got upgraded lighting and put more corals in there.


Here's it when in August when I just moved into the house and bought one halide



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Most people don't realize that large pieces of coral, which have been painted brown and attached to the skull by common wood screws, can make a child look like a deer.
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  #12  
Old 12/30/2007, 02:17 PM
geoxman geoxman is offline
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Although the initial post was kind of nanny nanny boo boo and it has only been going for 4 months, it can be done.

demonsp-it seems a little harsh to call the guy a liar.

Where he lives in Minnesota there might be great tap! There are a ton of spring fed lakes and it is known as the state of 10,000 lakes.

dasstheboss good luck with your tank and it looks very nice.
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  #13  
Old 12/30/2007, 03:12 PM
siwelk siwelk is offline
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i have to agree that 4 months is a little soon to claim success in a reef aquarium. there are many different problems that take time to develop before they become apparent. there are parts of the country that have amazingly low TDS tap water and i am curious as to what the posters TDS actually is.

for me, personally, i think of my tank like i do my car. (i happen to also be a car enthusiast as well) it may be more convenient/cheaper to run a slightly lower grade of oil or lower octane fuel, but in the long run, in some way, its going to be detrimental. i figure if somethings worth doing, its worth doing right, and even if my TDS on my tap water was say under 20...id still goin with 0 TDS RO/DI. if you want the best results you gotta have the best components, thats the plain and simple truth.


so kudos to those using tap water and having successful thriving reefs. i wouldnt claim success too early though, it could come back to bite you in the ***. im not trying to take any sides one way or the other, im just saying in a hobby that literally can live or die on miniscule parameters, you better just go with RO/DI.



JMO
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  #14  
Old 12/30/2007, 05:37 PM
badpacket badpacket is offline
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I have a buddy who's run tap water direct from the garden hose to the tank. He's been running this way for years, with few problems.
He does not run a lot of the higher light SPS though, and only has minimal coraline algae. But doesn't supplement either...
Water must be pretty good in Concord, CA though.

Due to a remodel, I had to give him my softies for the past couple of months. Now he's gotta get out of the hobby for a while, so in addition to getting my stuff back, I'm getting his, plus his dual 250w halide canopy.
We'll see how nice I can get them looking, just ordered new RO from BFS, and Russ finally got the .35m filter in.
Gonna take a before in his tank, and after in mine after a month or two

If I remember, I'll post some pics. i have no doubt that a lot of tanks can live and thrive even, with tap. And also think that we could possibly going crazy with trying to get ultra-pure water for many tanks that are up.
I wonder if tap with decent filter media, carbons, and a GFO might not be almost as good for non-SPS corals.
  #15  
Old 12/30/2007, 06:44 PM
GoingPostal GoingPostal is offline
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I read in one of those reefkeeping articles that tds doesn't really equate to water quality, that low tds could still have horrid things in it and high tds could still be great water. I am curious as to my tds, I'm hoping to buy a ro system from the filter guys before I set up my new tank so I'll find out then.

It is amusing being called a liar though, not sure why demonsp is convinced that all tap is the devil and it's impossible to keep anything alive in it. I realize many places have horrid tap but water quality varies on where you live.

Honestly when I first started I just didn't know any better, had a 58 gallon with crushed coral, 5 pounds live rock, my clownfish, emperor 400 for filtration and a supreme superking moving water. About as ghetto as you can get. Then once I knew better I was in an apartment where my landlord was crazy about water usage, I kept getting accused of using his washer which I wasn't and how high the bill was so I didn't think hooking up ro was a good idea there. Then I just kinda stopped caring since the armaggedon I'd been assured of didn't happen. What's even more funny is that the only algea I seem to be able to grow is diatoms on the front glass after a few days, but only in my two newer nanos with lower flow.

I bought some algea infested corals from a fellow reefer and even the bubble algea hasn't spread or grown in three months in my tank and all the hair and bryopsis has entirely died off. Now another person with her rocks and corals has hair and bubble out of control with ro water and good skimmer. I obviously don't keep sps other than a monti cap frag that I got free with the other corals but I don't have much desire to keep up with testing calcium and dosing. I like my lazy tank.

I do have a hard time growing coraline in this tank, my other two nanos it spreads fast, this tank it doesn't grow at all. Not sure if it's the higher lighting or more hard corals sucking it up or what. I also run all my tanks sumpless due to apartment living with no real filtration except the rock, the 33 has a remora skimmer and used to have a makeshift fuge but I can't get cheato to grow so I quit that. I test about four times a year and usually come out low on calcium and alk and about 2.5 nitrates on my sailfert test.

Anyways I agree four months is early to be claiming success in anything but demanding all the livestock live out their lifespans before accepting that tap can work in some tanks is a bit extreme. How many tanks on RC last even ten years? Everyone sticks to what works for them and kudos for that. BTW folks, I'm a girl. Have a good New's Years everybody!
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Most people don't realize that large pieces of coral, which have been painted brown and attached to the skull by common wood screws, can make a child look like a deer.
*Jack Handey
  #16  
Old 12/30/2007, 06:57 PM
geoxman geoxman is offline
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sorry about that goingpostal! You have a great looking tank and keep up the good work.
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  #17  
Old 12/30/2007, 08:39 PM
stevelkaneval stevelkaneval is offline
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heres my tank its a 20 long about a year old and ive never used ro/di.

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]
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  #18  
Old 12/30/2007, 10:40 PM
DGAF DGAF is offline
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Using a RO/DI is the only way to go. Were I live the water is very good, with a tds of 22, and i still use my RO/DI water. Just one less thing to worry about for me i guess.

Oh, Nice tanks for all of the ones who provided or posted pics.
  #19  
Old 12/30/2007, 11:25 PM
sohaltangs sohaltangs is offline
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There was a store here in Columbus,OH named Byerlys aquarium that was around for years (they recently closed for good), anyway they had a 75 gal. reef tank for there display with one of the largest toodstool leathers I have ever seen. approx 2 feet across edge to edge, thay also had plenty of other softies in it. It was a fantastic looking tank. They ran vho's on it for years and then switched to mh. They always used tapwater on it,so I asked what supplements and such they used and they told me none!!
I was suprised to here that all they did was regular water changes. they also had a skimmer on it. that tank looked great for at least ten years.
Oh and they told me also that there tap water was not that great,
at least compared to city water.
p.s. even though I know what they did I still use a 6 stage r.o. d.i.
unit
  #20  
Old 12/31/2007, 02:12 AM
Theexp Theexp is offline
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I thought it'd be fine to use tapwater, but apparently it wasn't for my area. Right now i have like 2inches of disgusting brown hair algae, and some green all over the tank. Although I have a large cleanup crew and a good skimmer, I do not run phosban or anything though. I will be moving to rodi and running a phosphate reactor now though.
  #21  
Old 12/31/2007, 02:40 AM
ricks ricks is offline
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Here are a couple of pictures of our 500 gallon reef... I use unfiltered mud puddle water, has worked great for many years.

Just kidding..

If your choice is tap water more power to you. Most hard core reefers would never trust there prized reefs to tap water..

Happy Reefing


  #22  
Old 12/31/2007, 07:56 AM
sohaltangs sohaltangs is offline
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WOW. now thats a beautiful tank!!
  #23  
Old 12/31/2007, 08:08 AM
GoingPostal GoingPostal is offline
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Good thing I'm not a "hardcore" reefer than. I have no desire to keep sps and have to worry about my tank, I know it'll weather a disaster or me leaving some one else in charge for week. Like I said, I take the lazy approach. I add water daily and do water changes weekly, other than that the tank handles itself with no fancy equipment.
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Most people don't realize that large pieces of coral, which have been painted brown and attached to the skull by common wood screws, can make a child look like a deer.
*Jack Handey
  #24  
Old 12/31/2007, 08:32 AM
CWebHokie CWebHokie is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ricks
... I use unfiltered mud puddle water, has worked great for many years.
Hahah!!! Awesome...

No seriously, you can have some (or even a lot of) luck with tap water. I personally have 75 TDS water and used it for a while (~2 years) with some success and some problems. (hair algae, general coral unhappiness). I have since switched to RODI (almost 1 year) & my tank has had a much higher success rate. The only way to know exactly what is going into your tank is to use an RODI and strip the H2O down to 0 TDS and build it back up with supplements. It is possible that in some areas tap water has the perfect chemistry for use in a saltwater tank, but I am not willing to risk it. At least at 0 TDS, you know what is there, nothing... Good luck though with the tap water, I'm interested to see the progress.
  #25  
Old 12/31/2007, 01:10 PM
miwoodar miwoodar is offline
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If you play with fire you could get burned. Your water could be fine but why would you take the chance? I used tap water for years before buying an RO/DI set up. The first city I lived in was OK (not great, but I was too much of a rookie to realize it). The second city was terrible.

Your tank is off to a great start (no joke) but I agree with the other folks - four months is too early to claim success. With the money and time you have already invested in your tank, you should buy an RO/DI just to be safe. The road to nursing a tank back to health after it runs amuck is agony and can take a year or more. I had to go through it and I almost dropped the hobby before things came back into line.
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