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Old 02/27/2010, 06:30 PM   #1
Scott-CapeCoral
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** Share any symptoms of possible palytoxin poisoning you may have experienced.

I would like anyone to participate in describing personal detailed symptoms from possible palytoxin poisoning. What I mean exactly is, what have you felt, or felt like, after fragging zoanthids or palythoa.

For almost a year now I've had random "anxiety attacks" They occur out of no-where sometimes. These symptoms from my attacks are best described as, The flight or fight feeling (Scared out of my mind) . Very rapid heart rate. Pain in my chest. Abnormal breathing (Fast shallow breaths that leave me feeling as if I'm suffocating.) Extreme dizzy spells(I've had to pull the emergency air brake in the middle of an intersection while driving a cdl vehicle).

There are other symptoms that have been very strange that seem to have nothing to do with an anxiety attack. One of them being strange swelling in random areas for what seems to be absolutely no reason. One time it was on the side of my head above my ear, another was on the inside of my arm in the bicep area, and other occasions on the bottom of my feet.

Now lately I've been noticing alot of this is happening shortly after fragging or handling zoanthids and paly's. I'm always fragging them, so I'm exposed to them usually every week or two. This got Delilah and I thinking this is a very possible culprit for what's been going on with me. I also realised these started around the time really started fragging these guys like crazy. About a year or more ago. I've been doing alot of reading about the palytoxin and symptoms of palytoxin poisoning and it is a mirror image of exactly what I described b4 to you all just now, and the doctors. I've gone to the ER twice in the middle of the night for these reasons. Once during work via ambulance. I'm really wondering if this is the reason behind all of this madness. If so, I'll need to make new doctors appointments and let them know what I think has been happening. I'm only 25 years old, I shouldn't be feeling as if I'm dieing like this. I'm very excited to know that I may have found out the reason.. This palytoxin is no joke people. Read about it, and some of the reported cases- you'll wear gloves from then on.. Please share some experiences any of you have had. Even if you thought they weren't coral toxin related. It would help me out a lot thanks a million.

Scott.


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Old 02/27/2010, 10:20 PM   #2
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I have a number of food "allergies." You summarized some of my symptoms here:

"For almost a year now I've had random "anxiety attacks" They occur out of no-where sometimes. These symptoms from my attacks are best described as, The flight or fight feeling (Scared out of my mind) . Very rapid heart rate. Pain in my chest. Abnormal breathing (Fast shallow breaths that leave me feeling as if I'm suffocating.) Extreme dizzy spells(I've had to pull the emergency air brake in the middle of an intersection while driving a cdl vehicle)."

I can get some impressive psychological effects along with the physical. I've found I do best if I carefully avoid known problems and benedryl is wonderful stuff when I get into something new. If my ears start ringing I get the benedryl out.

I fragged a big paly colony several weeks ago, maybe 200 heads into 20 or so pieces. I'd broken off a bit two now and then before, but never bnear so much at once. No gloves or anything. I felt sick after a few minutes but finished up. Had significant problems for a couple weeks that are just tapering a way now.

It felt like my "allergy" problems. There's a lot of history in my familly of "sensitivities" to foods and other allergens. I'm thinking this is what happened to me so it's definitely a YMMV thing. I'll be much more carefull with these things in the future.


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Old 02/28/2010, 11:50 AM   #3
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I always wear latex gloves and really,you should wear safety glasses,as Ive heard of people getting the poison in their eyes,from rubbing eye after handling zoos.I always wash my hands and arms thoroughly,just like a surgeon after handling these guys.
Im a paramedic myself,I dont know much about S/S of the toxin,but i would take it easy on these guys for a while,sounds like you have a substantial amount of toxins in your system,you could always be more allergic to the poison than others also.


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Old 02/28/2010, 03:15 PM   #4
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The skimmer probably is our best friend to remove any lost mucus from the colonies, most of the time.

Well, I had some of the symtoms you've got, specially the rapid heart rate, sometimes mild chest pain and the anxiety attacks. I had somethig going on with my legs when sleeping, or almost sleeping. I felt like kicking for nothing, and did kick when felt that!! I thought they could be related with something elses, like stress to pay the bills and wake up early to fight traffic.

Reading your post I remember now that has been a while I don't have such symptoms and at the same time I've had been only doing regular maintenance in my tank for many months, without touching the colonies nor cutting them for new frags.

I am the type of person that like to eat health and sometimes exercise. But I do love chocolate!! I was wondering why those sysmptoms were going on. Hey, that was the time I was setting up my system when I felt most of those symptoms!!

In the past I've had my right eye red after a spill when fragging a zoa conoly, but it didn't hurt nor was red for more than 2 hours. I flushed with worm water right after the accident.

I remember one time when I had a reaction on my skin during a frag section, nothing really bad.
I never used gloves to deal with the frags nor to do maintenance.
I'm considering that now.

Anyone else?

Thanks for the thread and info!
Hope that helps.
Grandis.


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Old 03/03/2010, 07:47 PM   #5
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Yea, I usually notice the anxiety or sometimes a metallic taste in my mouth. Hard to say what is really going on but I do notice it consistently when working with palys, I even use gloves sometimes.


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Old 03/03/2010, 08:22 PM   #6
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I had gotten sick a few times before i put 2 and 2 together. My symptoms would be like the flu starting. That achy feeling you get especially in my legs along with the chills would happen . After a bunch of times with these symptoms i figured it out. The bottom of my 180 was covered with this one particular paly. Every water change i would siphon out all the detritus in them. How did i start the siphon? thats right just suck on the tube. After 3 or so buckets i had my share of palytoxin!!! I also got it from having my face buried in my sump for awhile after a big paly removal via tweezers. If the skimmer does remove the mucus and i think it does you need to be real careful with that stuff at that time. Really glad you brought this up . I have some other questions and observations about this. Mike


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Old 03/05/2010, 05:35 PM   #7
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Before i wore FULL BSI i was doing some fragging... fragged and then later that night felt beyond sick. Grabbed the porcelain after there was nothing left but acid... rapid heart rate like after 20 red bulls shaking.. later on i noctied i had a open cut on finger drank TONS of water to flush anything out. other then vomiting and feeling like a meth addict with anxiety for a couple of hours.. im here to tell this tale..


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Old 03/07/2010, 06:38 PM   #8
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I've also experienced a metallic taste in my mouth, even when I swear there was no way my hands were anywhere near my mouth. I've had the flu symptoms twice. The first time I wasn't sure, but the second time I was certain. Wasn't sick to my stomach, but bad chills and aches for a few hours.


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Old 03/07/2010, 10:07 PM   #9
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I was doing some fragging and I had a cut on my finger got some paly mucus in it, about an hour later I had the metalic taste in my mouth, for about 2 hours. Next time I will use gloves


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Old 03/10/2010, 02:02 PM   #10
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palytoxin = dead

There are no symptoms... Well maybe some a few minutes before you expire.

Bacterial infection is what most people get. Those with high alergies will see more symptoms.

BTW, Lexapro or Zoloft will help with those anxiety attacks.


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Old 03/10/2010, 04:15 PM   #11
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BTW, Lexapro or Zoloft will help with those anxiety attacks.
dont forget xanax!! what a life saver that is


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Old 03/10/2010, 07:50 PM   #12
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interesting thread.


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Old 03/15/2010, 11:59 AM   #13
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Just got toxin in the eye 2 days ago cutting pe. As soon as it squirted, my eyes closed....reflex. A little bit of the toxin seeped into the eye. I felt a little sting, very minor. So I rinsed it only a little with warm water and continued fragging thinking no big deal. What an idiot I was. Same night I got red eye, no pain, no itch, just red. Then I tried lubricating drops left over from my lasik surgery. Didn't work. So I went to walgreens and got visine for red eye. Dropped it all day and didn't work. Today my eye is red and I can see the red vains clearly, little swollen, little throbbing and feeling miserable. So I went on google to find all the information I can get on what to do and I come across this thread. Just want everyone to know, wear glasses. It's not worth it. I don't think I will loose my eye, but it feels like crap. I will never frag again without glasses and gloves.



Last edited by DH212; 03/15/2010 at 12:10 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 03/15/2010, 03:03 PM   #14
Scott-CapeCoral
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Greats posts folks. Thanks for participating and keep them coming.

To DH212 I hope you make a full recovery. Sorry to hear that.


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Old 03/16/2010, 05:36 PM   #15
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The top of my eye looks white now. The middle stays pink color and a little swollen. When I stare strait and move my head side to side, it forms a little bubble on the pink part next to the eyeball. Doesn't feel too bad now, just dry. I think I will have a full recovery soon.

Just be careful everyone. I barely got a drip in my eye and look what happened. If the polytoxin actually squirted in, I may be blind.


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Old 03/16/2010, 10:16 PM   #16
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http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...3ee7727b11d33c


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Old 03/18/2010, 07:45 PM   #17
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Palytoxin=death, perhaps in some cases that get enough toxin.
I am here to say that I had the crap scared out of me while fragging one day.
After fragging, I moved everthing back to the tank an WHAM! Rapid heart rate and very flush face...like I ate too much B12.

From what I knew, I thought....I'm dead, right? Symptoms existed for about 20 mins. and started to decline.

I should have called 911, but I'm a guy. "It'll pass".
I'm VERY careful now....I don't want my wife to call me #$%^&* anymore.


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Old 03/18/2010, 08:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DH212 View Post
Just got toxin in the eye 2 days ago cutting pe. As soon as it squirted, my eyes closed....reflex. A little bit of the toxin seeped into the eye. I felt a little sting, very minor. So I rinsed it only a little with warm water and continued fragging thinking no big deal. What an idiot I was. Same night I got red eye, no pain, no itch, just red. Then I tried lubricating drops left over from my lasik surgery. Didn't work. So I went to walgreens and got visine for red eye. Dropped it all day and didn't work. Today my eye is red and I can see the red vains clearly, little swollen, little throbbing and feeling miserable. So I went on google to find all the information I can get on what to do and I come across this thread. Just want everyone to know, wear glasses. It's not worth it. I don't think I will loose my eye, but it feels like crap. I will never frag again without glasses and gloves.
Best preventive for that type of accident is to get running warm water on the eyes fast after that happens.

Grandis.


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Old 03/18/2010, 08:28 PM   #19
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I had a bit of juice squirt in my mouth once. My tounge was numb in about 5minutes and stayed that way for appx 4 hours. Now I wear gloves, goggles, and one of those breather masks like for lawn care. That one incident was enough for me...


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Old 03/18/2010, 08:29 PM   #20
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I was fragging zoes and some how got it by my eye and got a form of viral pink eye that took over two weeks to get over, with going to a eye DR. three times a week for them to clean and treat it. Cant think of what all they said it was but, the eye dr would close that side of the office when i was there and were gloves and the hole nine yards . Also now i always get a metal tast when come in contact with any zoes.


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Old 03/19/2010, 10:16 AM   #21
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Quote:
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Best preventive for that type of accident is to get running warm water on the eyes fast after that happens.

Grandis.
Initially when It seeped into my eye. It only stung a little, then stopped. So I thought, no big deal, didn't get me. Next day I look like this Now it's too late to run warm water.


Quote:
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I was fragging zoes and some how got it by my eye and got a form of viral pink eye that took over two weeks to get over, with going to a eye DR. three times a week for them to clean and treat it. Cant think of what all they said it was but, the eye dr would close that side of the office when i was there and were gloves and the hole nine yards . Also now i always get a metal tast when come in contact with any zoes.
My eye is still pink. Doesn't look like it's going to change back any time soon. Thanks for posting. Now, I know I can have a white eye again.


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Old 03/19/2010, 02:50 PM   #22
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a coulpe years ago I had set a big rock on a shelf to dry out and kill off the brown Paly's (2-3 months) when I got it down they where all dryed up and dusty I set it in my sump. I know now that was very bad thing to do. my tank crashed and me and my english bulldog got very sick I felt all the things listed here I made it but my dog didn't so keep pets away also.


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Old 03/19/2010, 02:57 PM   #23
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Don't try to kill palys by using boiling water.... I've heard bad stories about that.


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Old 03/22/2010, 08:51 AM   #24
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I have also experienced weird symptoms, twice.
The first time was when we had set up our tank, we had a big rock filled with paly's, wich both of us (me and my boyfriend) touched and arranged so it would look best in the tank.
Afterwards I felt sick, and so did my boyfriend.
It was like a bad cold, feeling dizzy, tired and I had problems swallowing
also I felt really thirsty, I drank a lot of water and cola trying to get rid of the thirsty feeling. My hart beat whent up a little.
Also I had problems breathing, it was like the air didnt have enough oxygen, I felt like I needed a deep breath but I couldn't.
I just thougt I was getting a cold and I was tired, it had been a long day setting up the tank.
Next day I still felt a little dizzy but I felt much better.
Never thought about it again.
When we got a new tank a few months later, same thing happened...
It struck me that it was probably because of the paly's.
We sold the big rock, but still have some on another rock.
I know I got sick because of them, but still i dont use gloves or anything.
I just try not to touch them, dont hold them with my hands etc.
When i will have to frag zoa's, I hope I don't forget to use safety glasses and gloves. Next month we will be setting up an even bigger tank. I know now that I am not putting those paly's in the new tank.
Never had any problems with other zoa's, just those...


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Old 03/22/2010, 10:42 AM   #25
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So it's been about nine days of the red eye from poly toxin. It was getting a little better at about day 6, then I started cutting wood for my tank stand and my eye got dry and started getting red again. Stayed red for a couple of days so I tried a salt water rinse my wife told me about. Yesterday I used very little non-iodized salt in a small bowl of water and poured it into my eyeball slowly. Rinsed it the same way 4 times that day. Now it is getting much better. From red to pink. I think if I continue this, it will go from pink to white in the few days.


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