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Old 01/09/2008, 09:42 AM   #1
rob.holbrook
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Green File Algae Plese Help!!!

So every morning I have a light green dusting of film algae on my glass

I never used to have this problem till I moved from dublin to marysville.

What I changed when I moved was

From PC Light Fixture to a Two 250Watt 15K MH Lights and 4 PC 64 Watt Atinics

Also started using RO water ... NOT RO DI

I am thinking that maybe the issue is that the RO system isnt as pure as it should be... maybe need to change cartridges

also wondering about light bulbs because they were the free bulbs that came with the unit... maybe should change them?

I haven't tested yet but will later .....

The tank is a 90 Gallon.... with a 29 gallon long sump.... with cheato and a sand bed w/some rock....

Have a skimmer that consistently pulls out gunk.


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Old 01/09/2008, 09:54 AM   #2
Genetics
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Unless you have a tear in your RO membrane the difference between RO and RO DI is rather minimal. For the most part ions passing through the membrane are sodium. Your issue may be more phosphate based. But phosphates should rarely get through the RO membrane.

I would change out the lighting on your chaeto first and see if that helps. It may just be the chaeto isn't getting enough light to out compete with your new lighting on the tank.


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Old 01/09/2008, 10:17 AM   #3
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I used to think DI did not do a whole lot until I did some testing with my TDS meter.

Before DI after RO: 35
After DI: 0

I intend to replace my RO membrane once I finish paying off my credit cards from Christmas, but it is in good shape (no visible tears) and is only 6 months old). However my percentage of removal is somewhat low.

However most people consider 35 too high for TDS. Although my final output after DI is 0.

You can get add-on DI cartridges from Buckeye Field Supply. This would be cheap insurance.

You may want to back off on feeding a bit too, that is where many phosphates come from.

HTH,
Ken
PS I get the film too every couple of days, I just clean it with a magfloat.


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Old 01/09/2008, 10:36 AM   #4
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I get the film too.

but on the r/o subject, holy cow! i was getting 14 tds and changed my r/o filter. I cant believe how much faster im getting water out of it. must have been pretty clogged.


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Old 01/09/2008, 02:15 PM   #5
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i am currently getting this film as well....i recently changed from 3-250 to 2-250, 1-400 and added 3-140watt VHO's...i think this has to do with lighting...does anyone know if water quality has a relationship to lighting? does more light=the need for better water? can't hurt to ask...thanks..in 3 days i changed about 125 gallons on a 250 system....i still get the film..


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Old 01/09/2008, 02:34 PM   #6
cl2ysta1
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bad bulbs can cause algae blooms. how old are your bulbs?


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Old 01/09/2008, 02:39 PM   #7
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Most Algae needs three things to grow:
Nutrients (Nitrates and phosphates primarily)
Light for photosynthesis (certain wavelengths favor different algaes)
A suitable environment to grow in (more flow = harder to grow usually).

If you eliminate any one of these, then algae will have a hard time surviving/thriving.

As lights age, they tend to frequency shift which can provide more light in a favorable spectrum for algae. This is true of MH, PC, and VHO.

Similarly adding more lights or changing lights can also affect certain algae's ability to grow. Changing bulbs or reducing photo periods may reduce algae by removing some of the light it needs, but may leaves the other building blocks present.

A number of prepared foods include nutrients like phosphate so even doing water changes may not eliminate the food source if you are continually reintroducing it via feeding.

Having said all this, I note I still get the film too. Some days it is worse than others, some days there is none at all. I am still trying to pinpoint exactly why, but wanted to share what I have worked out so far.


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Old 01/09/2008, 03:19 PM   #8
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35ppm is a bit high. I would change out the RO membrane if you have a spare. I was thinking more in the range of 7-10ppm being mostly sodium ions.

Again if you are eliminating your phosphates and nutrient export by chaeto I would change out the bulbs over the algae as they might have passed their prime. Also, choosing the wrong bulbs can change their growth.

I've gotten the green film from time to time. I usually find its day or two after adding too much food.


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Old 01/09/2008, 03:46 PM   #9
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both my 250's are getting close to being changed. they are reeflux bulbs and are getting close to 10 months old. other than that nothing has changed except adding the additional lighting. is blue actinic lighting a less desireable spectrum for algae?


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Old 01/09/2008, 04:02 PM   #10
Reefdiver72
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I have always got some algea on my front glass from the lights In every tank I have ever had light causes this I clean the glass about every other day just a light little film with lots of snail tracks. even after noon bulbs and tds at zero and everything testing good.


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Old 01/09/2008, 04:40 PM   #11
mrwilson
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I'm interested in what might be "normal" in terms of this slight algae film. Like Reefdiver72, I clean the glass off on three sides about every other day, or every third day. I suspect that others who might be less sensitive about this would let it go a couple days longer - I just like to have very clean glass. Does every other day or so sound about right?


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Old 01/10/2008, 06:38 AM   #12
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Marysville

I live in Marysville and if you dont use RO/DI you will always have an alge problem.

You will find that the water in Marysville Sucks for any thing but watering the yard.

Good luck it's a constant battle.


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Old 01/10/2008, 12:33 PM   #13
rob.holbrook
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It is like everyday .... I have this cloudy light green stuff on the glass, I can just take the mag float over it and it falls off the glass.... what I mean is that it looks like dust when you blow it but it is green...

I am just so tired of seeing this every day.....

as for my fuge lighting I have the 26 watt Twist bulbs from HD....

I just dont think this can be right...


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Old 01/10/2008, 01:03 PM   #14
Genetics
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Rob you're right it doesn't sound quite right. My tank needs cleaned every 2-3 days to keep the algae off and it is not the green I think you're talking of. I did have this problem at some point in this hobby but after going RO I haven't had it. Especially if you have a refugium. Try running some carbon and think about doing a water change and see if that helps at all.


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Old 01/10/2008, 01:42 PM   #15
rob.holbrook
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okay I will try the carbon... and will do a 10 percent water change .... i guess it could be my RO system.... like I said I have the RO just not the DI add on. I may take it to the local place and get it tested to see what the tds is....

I really wonder if it is the lights.... I just know that once the halides come on ... is when I get that green stuff.... everything in the tank looks great...

I have sps corals..... lps corals and fish


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Old 01/10/2008, 02:02 PM   #16
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Rob,

I also have been having this problem for a while now. I usually just clean it off with the magfloat but it is a pain when you have to do it daily. I'm trying all sorts of things and changing my lights didn't help at all. I recently replaced all my sand, started running chemi pure, and started a small fuge with chaeto. I'll let you know if I have any luck...At this point I think I might just be an overfeeder?


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Old 01/10/2008, 02:18 PM   #17
mdisalvo55
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Oh and I also ordered a nano koralia to see if that might help...


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Old 01/10/2008, 03:50 PM   #18
rob.holbrook
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well I had my RO water tested..... and it is at

65 TDS

I have a culligan RO system with no DI add on

Tested marysville water.... it was 745 TDS

I am thinking about changing my filters and getting the di add on from buckeye field supply.

What do you guys think should the filters get changed? Culligan wants 200 dollars for the 4 filters I would need.

It would almost be cheaper to buy a new one from buckeye field supply....

As far as feeding goes I feed every other day, and rinse the food.

Walkette - my mail box was full I emptied it out.


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Old 01/10/2008, 06:30 PM   #19
rob.holbrook
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Just did tests on tank

Phospates were at 0 to 5 ppm couldnt tell based on color
Nitrates - 10 ppm
Nitrites - 0
Ammon - 0
PH - 8.8
Salinity was at 1.25

once again I had to clean the glass that is twice today

also my LT Aneome isnt looking too good it has been closed up most of the day, other than that everything looks great

I just dont know what to do, I am worried something isnt right but do not know where to start at


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Old 01/10/2008, 06:45 PM   #20
rob.holbrook
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Pictures of this green stuff















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Old 01/10/2008, 06:48 PM   #21
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do you have anyone close with another test kit? I would say test with another and see if the results are the same.


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Old 01/10/2008, 07:40 PM   #22
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I still think the light change might help. if your bulbs are ending their life anyways i would change them. Also do the water tests like suggested


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Old 01/10/2008, 08:17 PM   #23
haggarse
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I should preface that I am novice compared to the majority of people on here but do have a few thoughts/suggestions:

*65 TDS is too high. Even if others have the same TDS reading with no issues, I still think the TDS is too high and would recommend nothing short of a series of 20G water changes.

*Toss the Chemipure and run Rowaphos. I have run both and there is a huge difference in my opinion.

*My understanding is small fuges don't do much. Consider a larger fuge.

*Lastly, try leaving the lights off for a day and see if the algae reduces. If the algae reduces the bulbs could be the culprit but not necessary the sole one. However, if the algae does not reduce, you can focus on the water perameters and assume the bulbs are most likely not the issue.

If all else fails bring a water sample to Phishy this weekend or the CORA meeting next Thursday and we'll test it.

Like I said, I have limited experience but thought I would try to help.

Sean


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Old 01/10/2008, 10:37 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by rob.holbrook
well I had my RO water tested..... and it is at

65 TDS

I have a culligan RO system with no DI add on

Tested marysville water.... it was 745 TDS

I am thinking about changing my filters and getting the di add on from buckeye field supply.

What do you guys think should the filters get changed? Culligan wants 200 dollars for the 4 filters I would need.

It would almost be cheaper to buy a new one from buckeye field supply....

As far as feeding goes I feed every other day, and rinse the food.

Walkette - my mail box was full I emptied it out.


That is a 91% rejection rate. Some membranes are rated at 90% rejection so you could very well be within the desired rates but most people have the DI following to remove the remaining ions. I would think you should add a DI cartridge or even 2 after the RO system. Be sure to get one that is refillable since it sounds like you will use lots of resin with the 65 TDS after the RO. Be sure to send the RO water to your drinking water supply, icemaler etc.. do not use the DI water for drinking.

If you have a 98% rejection membrane then it sounds like time to replace that membrane since you are at 91%. You can just get a complete system from BFS for less than the Culligan filters. You would save money by just running the RO/DI for the aquarium and not have to replace the filters in the Culligan whole house system.

Hope that helps.


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Old 01/11/2008, 05:57 AM   #25
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I agree with Itzme (and Sean), add the DI, 65 is too high.

I can replace all three filters in my RO/DI system for $30, the membrane is another $38. The Culligan filters costs as much as I paid for my whole system originally.

If the color is correct in your pictures, your algae is much more green than what forms on my glass. Mine is more of a brownish color.

I have a Phosphate colorimter if you want an accurate reading, most test kits are questionable for phosphate.

10 nitrate also sounds high (for a reef). Water changes will help this as well as cutting back on feeding.

HTH,
Ken


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