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Old 10/05/2008, 09:33 PM   #226
Aquarist007
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Re: Location, location, location

Quote:
Originally posted by reefamundo
Waterkeeper - I have been researching reef tanks for 3 months now. Of course, I was ready to buy after 2 weeks, and then luckily I posted a question on the Board and they all suggested I do a bit more research. I am still at it.

I am reading through the Reefkeeping basics and have a question on location. What advice can you give me on putting my first-ever reef tank in my living room. I have a small freshwater one in there now, but it's only 20 gallons. Here are some of my considerations:
- I want to have it where we can enjoy it.
- I have a utility tub within 15 feet of my targeted location.
- My garage is directly behind it, but the temperature variations (below freezing to over 80) would likely reek havoc on keeping spare water there, even if I built a little insulated storage area.
- The floor is concrete covered with some nice new carpet
- I am preferring to get a 120g tank with sump underneath.

How much water spillage and other associated mess might end up on my carpet? I don't mind a few quarts here and there, but if water changes, etc might result in a gallon or two semi-frequently, I'd like to know that now. Anything else I should be considering? Thanks.
what is underneath the proposed tank room reefamundo--is it possible to have all your sump, ect underneath the floor. No more spills ect
my setup is posted back a page on this thread


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Old 10/06/2008, 05:22 AM   #227
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When I change water or do maintenance where Ineed to put my arm in the water I always put a couple of heavy towels on the floor in front of the tank. My tank is in a finished basement with carpeting and my wife exercises a lot if you know what I mean.
I only had a flood once and that was from a hole in a pump hose that was shooting water over the tank on the floor.


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Old 10/06/2008, 11:14 AM   #228
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hats not good


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Old 10/06/2008, 05:34 PM   #229
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Well I guess if it is a rain hat then you might catch the water in that.




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Old 10/07/2008, 01:21 PM   #230
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Quote:
Originally posted by WaterKeeper
That is why one uses a sump. They help in diluting pollutants.
I worked with an environmental engineer whose mantra (repeated at every opportunity) was

'Dilution is no solution to pollution'

I was working in Puerto Rico on a project for my company some years back to update their wastewater treatment plant from a continuous system to a batching system. The outside engineer we hired christened the finished project by pouring a bottle of PR rum into the holding tank. I remarked to our environmental engineer that he was polluting the system to which he replied 'You should always take your liquor with a little water'.

Great articles - I shall read every word with awe.

Alan


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Sir Winston Churchill praising those young RAF pilots.
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Click on my name for drop down list and select "Visit EnglishRebels Home Page" for my build thread.

Current Tank Info: 60x30x24 200G AO custom glass tank, basement equipment room, 30G and 55G Fuges, LifeReef sump & 30" skimmer.
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Old 10/07/2008, 05:23 PM   #231
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Alan,

Nice to see someone else who worked in environmental remediation but I still pee in the pottie.

Water changes are dilution but, with a RO/I giving you the source water, they are a solution to pollution in a marine tank.


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Old 10/07/2008, 06:47 PM   #232
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Folks - Thanks for the tips. I like the ScotchGuard and towel idea. Simple to implement. I was worried I might need to tear up some of the new carpet and lay some tile. I'm not sure my wife would approve :-)

By the way, it's a concrete floor so it might be tough to plumb it to the basement. It's doable but it feels a little too complex for me for my first reefing adventure. As a side note, my kids wanted me to build the aquarium into the bar in the basement. I told them the beer would spill into the top of the tank ... but it would look cool! Thanks -Jeff


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Old 10/08/2008, 06:23 AM   #233
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Happy fish!


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Old 10/09/2008, 07:21 AM   #234
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Sand Size

Waterkeeper
I read in your article on sand that you recommend 0.05 to 2.00 mm. I have been following a tank build thread here on RC and someone made these comments.

'I'm now starting to turn my attention to the tank. I was contemplating the sand selection, both depth and granule size.
I'm thinking about a 2-3" sand bed. Thats approximately 600 pounds of sand. The choices are:
1) Aragamax Sugar 0.1 - 1.0mm
2) Aragamax Select 0.5 - 1.5mm
3) Aragamax Seaflor Special Grade 1.0 - 2.0mm
I've never had anything as small as sugar. I hear it looks nice but blows around like crazy. I was thinking of mixing equal parts Select and the Special grade although maybe I should mix equal parts of all 3?

also
I've found that whenever I've mixed sand, the larger size will eventually makes it's way to the top. It doesn't stay evenly mixed. I plan to use one size and stick with it so it stays uniform.

Any comments?
Thanks


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Alan

"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few. "
Sir Winston Churchill praising those young RAF pilots.
August 20th 1940
Click on my name for drop down list and select "Visit EnglishRebels Home Page" for my build thread.

Current Tank Info: 60x30x24 200G AO custom glass tank, basement equipment room, 30G and 55G Fuges, LifeReef sump & 30" skimmer.
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Old 10/09/2008, 07:57 AM   #235
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Well Alan, mixing all 3 would be the way to do it "by the book" but choice number 1, sand in the 0.1-1.0 mm range would work out the best if you chose a single type. We want the average size of sand in the bed to average a little over 0.125 mm and the majority of particles should be in the range of 0.1-0.25 mm range. That means what's in Bag Number 1 is our winner.

Here is Ron Shimek's original article on sand How Sandbeds REALLY Work. It explores the reason for sand sand selection criteria in detail.


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Old 10/09/2008, 08:04 AM   #236
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Dam, my ruller doesen't measure 1-1.0 mms.
I am going to Home Depot to get a MM ruller.
I think some of my grains are 1MM, do I have to take out all the grains that are a different size?


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Old 10/09/2008, 08:07 AM   #237
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What about the comments on very fine sand that you recommended (0.05 mm)? I didn't see it in the three options. Also some are concerned about it[list=1][*]Blowing around causing sand storms in high flow areas[*]Eventually working its way to the bottom of the sand bed.[/list=1]


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Alan

"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few. "
Sir Winston Churchill praising those young RAF pilots.
August 20th 1940
Click on my name for drop down list and select "Visit EnglishRebels Home Page" for my build thread.

Current Tank Info: 60x30x24 200G AO custom glass tank, basement equipment room, 30G and 55G Fuges, LifeReef sump & 30" skimmer.
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Old 10/09/2008, 10:28 AM   #238
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According to Doc Ron, the large range of sand sizes are desirable because different classes of organism colonize specific sand sizes. Having a wide range of sand sizes promotes bed diversity. A point to remember here is that one still needs to add true LS to seed the packaged sand. It provides some finer material right there. The Aragamax Sugar is the best choice in there offerings and should be fine if one uses enough seed sand, at least 10% or more.

Now Paul,

In your case I would add a ton of Miracle Mud to the bed. It will give you very fine sand, under 0.05 mm, which will do wonders when using a RFUGF.


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Old 10/09/2008, 12:35 PM   #239
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I already add Miracle "Long Island Sound" mud. It also does wonders.
It has nutrients like "essence of Oldsmobile fender" in it.


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Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971
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Old 10/09/2008, 01:12 PM   #240
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Hi to all! I love your post, wonderful and interesting! Allow me to share a video link I found out there, equally helpful and fun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znTmyVeKunM


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Old 10/09/2008, 01:49 PM   #241
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Hi Cymig

To Reef Central

You should also try to find a vid of Paul B's tank. The only tank where you cure junk cars.


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Old 10/11/2008, 08:38 AM   #242
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Quote:
Originally posted by Paul B
I already add Miracle "Long Island Sound" mud. It also does wonders.
It has nutrients like "essence of Oldsmobile fender" in it.
On the project I managed for my company in PR to upgrade their wastewater treatment plant, we had to take some measurements of the incoming effluent and the discharge water of the existing plant. We found that the discharge water was higher in zinc than the effluent. We couldn't figure this out - it didn't make any sense.
When we drained the holding tank to start the project we found maybe a dozen galvanized roofing sheets that apparently been blown in there during some of the hurricanes that this area is known for. Over the years the zinc from the galvanizing had leached into the water.


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Alan

"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few. "
Sir Winston Churchill praising those young RAF pilots.
August 20th 1940
Click on my name for drop down list and select "Visit EnglishRebels Home Page" for my build thread.

Current Tank Info: 60x30x24 200G AO custom glass tank, basement equipment room, 30G and 55G Fuges, LifeReef sump & 30" skimmer.
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Old 10/11/2008, 08:58 AM   #243
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Ah, another Water & Wastewater Guy. Have you run into AZDesert Rat yet. He's also a waterman.


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"Leading the information hungry reefer down the road to starvation"

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Old 10/11/2008, 09:12 AM   #244
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Quote:
Originally posted by WaterKeeper
Ah, another Water & Wastewater Guy. Have you run into AZDesert Rat yet. He's also a waterman.
I was a project manager -- you know the guy who gets everyone else to do the work and provide the knowledge but takes the credit I couldn't tell you how a wastewater treatment plant works except that nasty stuff flows in and "clean" water flows out.
Six Phases of a Project[list=1][*]Enthusiasm[*]Disillusionment[*]Panic[*]Search for the Guilty[*]Punishment of the innocents[*]Praise and Honors for the Non-Participants[/list=1]


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Alan

"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few. "
Sir Winston Churchill praising those young RAF pilots.
August 20th 1940
Click on my name for drop down list and select "Visit EnglishRebels Home Page" for my build thread.

Current Tank Info: 60x30x24 200G AO custom glass tank, basement equipment room, 30G and 55G Fuges, LifeReef sump & 30" skimmer.
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Old 10/11/2008, 09:19 AM   #245
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Quote:
We found that the discharge water was higher in zinc than the effluent.
This is the secret of the longivity of my tank. Now everyone knows.


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Old 10/12/2008, 05:43 AM   #246
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Alan,

The project managers go to the same classes as consultants. The only extra credit classes consultants take is to listen to everything the people who hired you say and to rephrase what they said in your final report.

Zinc is an essential nutrient Paul.


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"Leading the information hungry reefer down the road to starvation"

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Old 10/12/2008, 05:48 AM   #247
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Alright you Newbies; Listen up!

Check at this month's [rk] and check out Russ Schultz's excellent article on Various Nutrient Control Methods. A very clear and concise article on the subject.


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Old 10/12/2008, 06:29 AM   #248
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I quite like the Vodka Method but I'm afraid the vodka would not reach the tank With this method do you have to stir it or shake it???
BTW the operative syllable of Consultant is CON


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Alan

"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few. "
Sir Winston Churchill praising those young RAF pilots.
August 20th 1940
Click on my name for drop down list and select "Visit EnglishRebels Home Page" for my build thread.

Current Tank Info: 60x30x24 200G AO custom glass tank, basement equipment room, 30G and 55G Fuges, LifeReef sump & 30" skimmer.
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Old 10/12/2008, 01:33 PM   #249
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Hello all,

If you are setting up a new tank for the first time, do the DT and refugium cycle in the same way and time? That is, say, if you are hitting your bacteria bloom or algae attack in the DT, will the refugium be similarly affected? Does the cycling affect the entire water column? I imagine it would, but was wondering what personal experience says.

For specific reference, I am setting up a "display" refugium slightly higher than the DT, where water is pumped to the refugium and gravity drains back to the DT.

Alas, I am a poor anal-retentive reefer wannabe and am curious about the cycling process in those other areas besides the DT.


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Old 10/12/2008, 02:03 PM   #250
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Quote:
Originally posted by WaterKeeper
According to Doc Ron, the large range of sand sizes are desirable because different classes of organism colonize specific sand sizes. Having a wide range of sand sizes promotes bed diversity. A point to remember here is that one still needs to add true LS to seed the packaged sand. It provides some finer material right there. The Aragamax Sugar is the best choice in there offerings and should be fine if one uses enough seed sand, at least 10% or more.

Now Paul,

In your case I would add a ton of Miracle Mud to the bed. It will give you very fine sand, under 0.05 mm, which will do wonders when using a RFUGF.
sugar fine sand should really be used when running a deep sand bed(over 5 inches) A deep sand bed is probably best run remotely as in a separate refugium--this way you get the benefits of the dsb and some of the possible problems with it remain away from the display tank.

a good medium argonite sand bed or 1-3 inches in the display tank will be enough to encourage the bethnic inverts, and anoxic bacteria* needed in the nitrogen cycle( as Waterkeeper suggested in the Shimek article)

**
aerobic bacteria----ammonia to nitrites--located on surfaces of live rock and sand bed
anerobic bacteria----nitrites to nitrates--located slightly below surface of substrate and crevices of live rock
anoxic bacteria----nitrates to nitrogen gas--located deep in substrate and inner core of live rock


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Current Tank Info: 150gal long mixed reef, 90gal sump, 60 gal refugium with 200 lbs live rock
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